tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post1856029893200405637..comments2024-03-29T05:45:39.184-06:00Comments on Blood-Red Pencil: Be My Guest - Jodie RennerDanihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14471919576687777886noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-36868980234532530552012-01-27T06:40:19.220-07:002012-01-27T06:40:19.220-07:00I've been doing a lot of this on my latest boo...I've been doing a lot of this on my latest book because it's set in 1991. What's funny is I find it really easy to write the teen characters because they're about my age at that time. But one of the adult characters is a newspaper reporter and I keep quizzing an older colleague to make sure I'm accurate for what was in use back then. You mentioned cell phones, and that's one of the big ones - I have to keep reminding myself that he can't call his editor unless he finds a pay phone. <br /><br />OTOH, I've found that the constraints of facts have actually enhanced some sections of the book — they even fixed a timeline issue I was having. Once I factored in a hurricane that took place in the area, it solved a couple of plausibility issues my editor had with the inciting event.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-66686441879630649562012-01-24T02:19:17.250-07:002012-01-24T02:19:17.250-07:00Interesting post. Thanks.Interesting post. Thanks.adult datehttp://www.upforit.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-81703280565621636332012-01-20T09:13:35.004-07:002012-01-20T09:13:35.004-07:00Thanks for a great discussion, everyone!
J.R., I...Thanks for a great discussion, everyone! <br /><br />J.R., I think simple, to-the-point, streamlined writing is the most effective, anyway - certainly for today's readers.<br /><br />Thanks, Maryann, for your comments about Elle's ideas. I don't read a lot of fantasy, but do enjoy it from time to time.Jodie Rennerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17180607353893233389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-66286506624245701162012-01-20T09:03:11.802-07:002012-01-20T09:03:11.802-07:00Elle, I like the idea of turning the real world on...Elle, I like the idea of turning the real world on it's head, so to speak, when writing fantasy. It is not a genre I read a lot in, but my daughter occasionally gives me a book to read. It is always fun to find an element of that pretend world that relates to something in reality. Much like the example you gave of Ronald Reagan. Readers can associate with that even though it is not factually correct. So my advice is take all the artistic license you want with your fantasy.Maryannwriteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09479027709233807149noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-70442736665911809582012-01-19T21:23:24.371-07:002012-01-19T21:23:24.371-07:00The Reagan example is from a Salman Rushdie novel,...The Reagan example is from a Salman Rushdie novel, not mine ;-) And it was amusing, if I remember correctly.Elle Carter Nealhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02266309723919011181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-58610284766474139192012-01-19T20:33:00.970-07:002012-01-19T20:33:00.970-07:00I do my best to write simply, not for the reader, ...I do my best to write simply, not for the reader, but for me, so when I edit I can figure everything out and not get freight trained by my own cleverness :DAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04454406837183787620noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-29003389189380154632012-01-19T17:24:44.897-07:002012-01-19T17:24:44.897-07:00Absolutely, Dani! I totally agree! I once edited a...Absolutely, Dani! I totally agree! I once edited a middle-grade novel in which all the 12-year-olds spoke like university professors, and used words like "exquisite" and "marvelous". And it was contemporary fiction!<br /><br />And yes, the narration also has to be from their point of view. If an 8-year-old walks into a room, he's not going to be thinking about the "Louis XIV antique furniture" (to use an extreme example). Better to mention things he'd notice first, like maybe a dog lying by the hearth, or whatever, and forget a detailed description of the interior decor.Jodie Rennerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17180607353893233389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-74732939759042698792012-01-19T17:17:40.008-07:002012-01-19T17:17:40.008-07:00I agree, Jodie. Even in third person narrative, th...I agree, Jodie. Even in third person narrative, the wrong expression can pull the reader out of the story. I'm having a discussion with a writer about first person narrative in a chapter book - it can't sound like an adult is talking. It has to sound like the dialogue. If the person talks like an eight-year-old, his first person narrative has to sound eight-years-old.Danihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14471919576687777886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-88041707410196386982012-01-19T17:14:59.008-07:002012-01-19T17:14:59.008-07:00Elle, I don't know what to suggest about the R...Elle, I don't know what to suggest about the Ronald Reagan thing, although my off-the-top advice would be to just write a brand new character for that instead of using a well-known figure.<br /><br />But for fantasy, pretty much anything goes, as Maryann said.Jodie Rennerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17180607353893233389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-3211023103290922082012-01-19T17:14:10.729-07:002012-01-19T17:14:10.729-07:00That sounds like a comedy to me, Elle. ;)That sounds like a comedy to me, Elle. ;)Danihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14471919576687777886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-38074483531264471862012-01-19T16:25:51.263-07:002012-01-19T16:25:51.263-07:00Yes, I should've clarified that it is a fantas...Yes, I should've clarified that it is a fantasy novel set in an alternate world.<br /><br />I'm also reminded of books in the Magical Realism genre where a fact might be changed for dramatic effect, like a reality where Ronald Reagan wins an Oscar for a movie role and never enters politics.<br /><br />ElleElle Carter Nealhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02266309723919011181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-88483439732175722052012-01-19T15:55:55.291-07:002012-01-19T15:55:55.291-07:00I agree with you, Dani. In my example of the write...I agree with you, Dani. In my example of the writer saying "he lived in an upscale neighborhood" for a novel taking place around 1850, the author thought it was fine because it was in the narration, not the dialogue, but I disagreed with him. I said that the term "upscale" appearing at all in the book jars the reader out of that historical period, even if they can't put their finger on why.Jodie Rennerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17180607353893233389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-6762646965884274412012-01-19T15:45:43.215-07:002012-01-19T15:45:43.215-07:00Etymology is a huge issue in historical fiction - ...Etymology is a huge issue in historical fiction - it's one of the things I look for hardest when editing. You might have a police radio in your novel, for example, because those were invented and used in the early 1900s, but you definitely wouldn't issue an APB because that acronym (and the expression "all-points bulletin") didn't come into popular use until decades later. This might sound like nitpicking, but the more popular your book, the more likely you'll hear about the error from a reader after your book is in print!Danihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14471919576687777886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-66542516605347652542012-01-19T10:27:49.602-07:002012-01-19T10:27:49.602-07:00Project Savior - Thanks for your story!
Christoph...Project Savior - Thanks for your story!<br /><br />Christopher - love your humor! (And, as a journalist, if you're not kidding, hope your superiors don't read your comments here!) LOL<br /><br />girlseeksplace - I have a huge amount of respect for writers of historical fiction! I'm not sure I'd have the patience and determination to do all that research to get the facts right on that time period!Jodie Rennerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17180607353893233389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-11583118646718252832012-01-19T10:22:34.307-07:002012-01-19T10:22:34.307-07:00Excellent post. I just set aside a historical fict...Excellent post. I just set aside a historical fiction novel - it's hard to write it and even more difficult to keep things accurate. I am constantly stopping to look things up.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-81524673581095626082012-01-19T08:35:15.423-07:002012-01-19T08:35:15.423-07:00As a journalist, I never let facts ... or logic .....As a journalist, I never let facts ... or logic ... get in the way of a good story.Christopher Hudsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03667548312923348614noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-15132683496168192982012-01-19T08:31:23.334-07:002012-01-19T08:31:23.334-07:00A funny fact checking story.
Issac Asimov was a we...A funny fact checking story.<br />Issac Asimov was a week or so into writing one of his books and he realized the planet free of Carbon Dioxide couldn't exist in nature. Since he was nearly finished he just pointed out that fact in the intro and finished the book.<br />I always think about that big oops when writing the first draft.Darrell B. Nelsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02851443183217238218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-38558165269955126272012-01-19T07:31:20.787-07:002012-01-19T07:31:20.787-07:00Thanks for all your comments! And thanks to Linda ...Thanks for all your comments! And thanks to Linda and Maryann for answering Elle's question about artistic license! I agree - proceed with caution on that.<br /><br />Arlee - that's really specific fact-checking! Wow! Most readers won't question what the weather was like on a particular day in history, unless it was a day we'll never forget, like the assassination of JFK, or 9/11. But kudos to you for being so conscientious and diligent!<br /><br />Serena - you're so right about shoddy translations being irritating and taking you out of the story - and maybe throwing the book across the room!<br /><br />Linda - Yes, I edited a historical fiction where the clothing was all wrong for the time period too - I ended up searching that online.<br /><br />Karen and Maryann - Can you share any useful fact-checking websites with us?<br /><br />Thanks to all of you!Jodie Rennerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17180607353893233389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-56565373488010233102012-01-19T06:31:38.852-07:002012-01-19T06:31:38.852-07:00Elle, when it comes to facts I don't think any...Elle, when it comes to facts I don't think any artistic license is good, unless you are writing a fantasy or sci-fi novel. That's one of the benefits of writing it those genres, you can create whole new worlds and introduce new things. For historical or contemporary fiction we really do have to do the research.Maryannwriteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09479027709233807149noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-67514563418132318582012-01-19T06:28:17.518-07:002012-01-19T06:28:17.518-07:00Elle, as a reader, I suggest you keep artistic lic...Elle, as a reader, I suggest you keep artistic license at a minimum. If I find discrepancies in a story regarding misplaced events or things, I won't read that author again.<br /><br />As an editor, I'll point out the error and urge a correction. I may even provide the research to support my position.<br /><br />As a writer, I try not to take artistic license at all because anything that pulls even one reader out of the story loses that reader of my books.Linda Lanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06686488133905538811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-5742326216975499042012-01-19T06:27:17.273-07:002012-01-19T06:27:17.273-07:00Like Karen, I am so pleased that you can do a lot ...Like Karen, I am so pleased that you can do a lot of fact checking online. I'm working on an historical mystery set in 1960 and frequently I am going online to make sure something I just put in the story actually existed then. Did you know that the first peculator coffeemaker was developed in 1865. Electric pots were introduced right after the turn of the century.Maryannwriteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09479027709233807149noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-18124035540281017622012-01-19T06:21:09.214-07:002012-01-19T06:21:09.214-07:00You're so right, Jodie. For the reader to susp...You're so right, Jodie. For the reader to suspend disbelief, the writer has to pay careful attention to details. This is particularly true in our age of technology because so many things we take for granted have been in existence only a short time.<br /><br />The first historical fiction book I edited contained a scene where a character zipped up her dress. Curiosity got the best of me, so I looked up zippers. They didn't exist in the time frame covered by the story. After that, I checked everything that raised the least question in my mind.<br /><br />Great post, Jodie!Linda Lanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06686488133905538811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-25616240420122627612012-01-19T03:45:57.361-07:002012-01-19T03:45:57.361-07:00Fact checking is so important, strongly agree! The...Fact checking is so important, strongly agree! There are numerous online sites (dependable ones) that give you invention timelines, event timelines, and so on. Great for historical fiction. It is wise to not depend on memory for facts. Excellent post! Am sharing!Karen S. Elliotthttp://www.karenselliott.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-33421061892748453902012-01-19T01:40:24.754-07:002012-01-19T01:40:24.754-07:00Oh I completely agree with you. There is nothing w...Oh I completely agree with you. There is nothing worse than being thrown out of a story because of incorrect data of any kind. One of my BIG bugbears is foreign language. Too often I see (multi) published authors use online translators and often they are completely inaccurate. These free sites are great to get the gist of something, but many languages have certain nuances that only a person who speaks the language will be able to translate. <br /><br />Great blog. Thanks!Serena Tatti Story Editorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925330119104651251noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5704943052235281766.post-90819200198283594492012-01-19T00:26:11.311-07:002012-01-19T00:26:11.311-07:00I agree that all those little details make a big d...I agree that all those little details make a big difference in allowing the story to flow without leaving any stumbling blocks to trip the reader.<br />I try to be very specific in checking everything down to what the weather was like on a particular day of history.<br />Outstanding tips for writers in this post.<br /><br />Lee<br /><a href="http://www.a-to-zchallenge.com/2012/01/video-challenge.html" rel="nofollow">Blogging from A to Z</a>Arlee Birdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11663942782929929334noreply@blogger.com